IPCC report: Massive holes in Abe & Ella’s arguments

This week we’re delving into the report on the IPCC investigation which Abe and Ella have (finally, after 3 months) shared on their blog. The report is a goldmine, as it spells out why police acted as they did, and shows Abe and Ella’s allegations up for what they are: foolish and without basis in fact.


Yesterday we reported that the IPCC investigation report revealed both that Abe had just been released from prison at the time he became involved with Ella and the children, and that Ella is still wanted by police for child abuse.

Today we’ll address some of the allegations that Abe & Ella have made against the police investigation—allegations which have fuelled the arguments of the hoax’s supporters, who don’t believe that they were answered adequately by Mrs Justice Pauffley’s judgement in March 2015.

First, though, the question on many people’s minds: how long can Abe & Ella keep this thing going?

Can Abe and Ella appeal this report?

According to the deadlines specified in the report’s cover letter, Abe and Ella had 28 days in which to submit an appeal, should they choose to do so. After 21 April, 2016, the IPCC would not be obligated to accept any appeal. IPCC intro-appeal deadline 2016-06-21However, Abe and Ella stated on their blog that the IPCC graciously allowed them some extra time to throw together yet another barrow-load of bilge: Screen Shot 2016-06-21 at 8.48.20 PMTo be honest, this surprises us.

In our opinion, far more than enough public money has been wasted on explaining to Abe & Ella why their ludicrous fantasies simply do not hold water. We find it shocking that the IPCC is willing to allow them to go another round in this fight.

However, we suppose Abe & Ella need something to keep them entertained in their charming pied-à-terre in the Principe Alfonso.

Did the police really tip off RD before his interview?

This is one of the allegations Abe & Ella levelled against the police, and it’s addressed in full in the IPCC investigation.

IPCC report-#2 2016-06-21

Sorry for the crooked screenshots: this is how they appear in the original document.

As DS Fernandez notes in this statement, RD was not, in fact, warned by police:IPCC-RD voluntary interview 2016-06-21The police tried to locate RD using information provided by his children, but despite the fact that they’d described his house in detail, even down to the alleged secret staircase leading to the basement, the children did not know where the house was located. (As it turns out, this is because RD was not living in London—so the children were forced to guess.)

Following the unsuccessful drive-round, the police tried various other methods to locate RD. However, just as he stated in his BBC interview with Victoria Derbyshire, RD had learned from someone in the Local Authority’s social services department that the police wished to speak with him.

Did he immediately decide the jig was up and book it for Spain, like Abe & Ella did when they realised the police were interested in speaking to them? Did he panic and tell his solicitor to keep the officers talking while he climbed out a back window and bravely ran away?

Oddly, he did neither of these things.

He did what any normal, responsible, non-guilty person might do when they know the police wish to talk to them in a matter concerning their children: he went to the police station and volunteered to be interviewed.

Well. Imagine that.

Why were no other ‘suspects’ interviewed?

According to Abe & Ella, ‘clear medical evidence’ along with the children’s ‘clear allegations’ should have led to those they named being interviewed, and then arrested.

However, the IPCC report points out that the children’s evidence was far from clear.IPCC #3-police names wrong, church details wrong 2016-06-21For one thing, they specifically named police officers who did not exist.

They offered detailed descriptions of the church, stating that the skulls and other evidence were stored in drawers and a refrigerator. When the church was searched extensively by police, no such hiding places were found.

Here’s the thing: just because the children’s allegations were clear does not mean that those allegations were true and accurate.

We could describe in great detail the Tyrannosaurus Rex that just ate the tree and several lilac bushes in our front garden, but that would not mean that a giant prehistoric reptile had in fact made a lunch of our oak tree.

We hope this is clear to the hard-of-thinking: clarity ≠ truth.

As for the ‘clarity’ of the medical results, it seems that initially, no written report of Dr Hodes’ findings were available to police. When Dr Hodes was contacted on 12 September, 2014, she told DS Fernandez that she was ‘alarmed’ by the children’s story, which she believed to be true. (We won’t get into the fact that Dr Hodes should not have approached these exams with any opinion as to the truth of the children’s stories.)

ilio
Dr Hodes did not deliver her written report to the investigating team until early January 2015, despite several requests to do so. And when she did, the report stated that while the slight anomalies observed might have been caused by abuse, they might also have been caused by other factors.

However, long before the final report was received, the children had been taken into protective custody and had retracted their allegations. IPCC-retractions 2016-06-21While this might come as a shock to Abe & Ella (and their legal advisor, apparently), once allegations have been withdrawn in a case, the investigation comes to a halt.

Literally, the case ceases to exist. It is no more. It has gone to meet its Maker. Bereft of life, it rests in peace. It is an ex-case.

That means that people who might have been ‘suspects’ while the case was active are no longer under suspicion, and thus they cannot be questioned. No matter what kind of grudge Abe & Ella might hold against their enemies, the police are now no longer empowered to haul them in and arrest them.

Abe & Ella might not like it, but that’s the way it is, and all the temper tantrums and appeals in the world won’t change it.

Gee, too bad. It was all looking so promising there, for about 5 minutes. Too bad so sad

48 thoughts on “IPCC report: Massive holes in Abe & Ella’s arguments

  1. The IPCC report is a very fair and thorough investigation of the false allegations made by Abe and Ella. It’s without doubt that those allegations were made maliciously.The allegations were frivolous and vexatious

    I would hope that the people who made considerable efforts in maintaining the false story are ultimately rewarded with sentences which reflect the damage that those false stories did to innocent parties.

    Its easy to see in the latest IPCC report that the delays the Police experienced getting a written report from the doctor with regards the children contributed to the investigation being prolonged.. I would hope that is investigated by the GMC..

    A question in my mind is who paid the bill for the legal work done by the solicitors in submitting the IPCC complaint and appeal on behalf on Ella Draper? Its beyond the scope of any possible funding that might have been available from Legal Aid, due of course to the complainant having given up her rights to any UK benefits (such as Legal Aid) after she absconded from the country

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  2. I can’t see there’s anymore to say tbh. Of course there will be, because the hardline nutjobs are suffering from Evidence Avoidance Syndrome. You can get tablets for it you know although sometimes a swift kick up the arse by way of an Injunction will do the job.

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    • Yes, quite predictably Abe and Ella are bellyaching about it on their blog. I imagine some of their hard-core supporters will continue to complain that the police didn’t do a thorough job, etc. But a read through this report is very instructive, as it shows how and why the police made the decisions they did in pursuing the investigation. It’s logical and straightforward…unlike the majority of those who will no doubt oppose it.

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  3. That idiot woman Hodes should be reprimanded by her professional body, people lose their children because of “evidence” like hers.

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      • And you wouldn’t want a mechanic who diagnosed your brakes while believing in your allegation that they were taken over and abused by a cult each week.

        It’s all right to describe the symptoms you observe to your mechanic (or a forensic doctor). It’s not all right to spend 3 hours telling a forensic physician a long and twisted tale about cults and anal rape and murder, before they examine your children for any potential signs of sex abuse.

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    • I agree. She apparently spoke to Ella for some time prior to examining the children as well. I would like to see her behaviour reviewed by her professional body.

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      • There is a very weird video about Dr Hordes on YouTube. I don’t know what to make of it:

        The message is very indistinct. I get the impression that Dr Hordes phone may have accidentally dialled a number whilst it was in her handbag and the recipient has interpreted the muffled voice as saying something relevant to her.

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        • How strange! I don’t know what to make of that either. The message sounds like something out of a horror film (and it made my cat run out of the room); I don’t hear anything like what the maker of the video seems to hear.

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      • In terms of righting some wrongs that have been highlighted by this case, I also think a complaint letter to the professional body overseeing Dr Hodes should be written to make them aware of the damage she has done/contributed to to a great measure, in terms of stoking the fire of the conspiritards, giving them ammunition with so called ‘evidence’ which was tainted by the emotional contagion she allowed to happen by questioning the mother of the children, ie Ella, who had an agenda. There should be guidelines about carrying out what are essentially forensic examinations which should exclude any kind of contamination, or swaying of opinion, which will inevitably affect the interpretation of results found. These should be free of any influence by associations with the ‘victims’ or their mothers, for example. Dr Hodes should have apologised about her mistakes in this case long ago, at the very least. Has anyone heard from her? I very much doubt it. Here again is an opportunity to sue for damages through her professional insurance for damages to the children and all the others involved.

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        • I fully agree on all points, Mark.

          Any professional who must do forensic work ought to be aware that they must not do anything which might contaminate their opinion in one direction or the other. Speaking with Ella as she did, and allowing Ella’s story to shape what she was looking for, is an egregious error, and she ought to be called to account for it.

          I believe that in the 19 March judgement, Mrs Justice Pauffley came as close as she could to publicly reprimanding Dr Hodes, but really, as you say, more should be done.

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      • It could have saved a lot of grief and stopped people spreading wrong information if only Dr Hodes had followed the regulations properly.

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  4. Amazing how these conspiritards insist the whole system is corrupt and not worth the paper is written on and yet are very quick to use its mechanisms when deemed to be in their own best interests.

    Whether this was all a convenient delay mechanism or naive hope to claim Trillions in compo perhaps we will never know.

    All in all Abe and Ella are hardly the greatest advert for the soul cleansing properties of hemp juice🙂

    Stirling work as ever EC.

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    • Genuinely turning a corrupt system back on itself is fine in my book. So long as you realise you have to deal with that system on its own terms. – That’s not what these conspiretards do though. Instead they use these situations to pursue and promote bizarre agenda that could only make ‘sense’ to the warped minds of the individuals who make up their target audience.

      Obviously Christie is a man of very limited intellect and poor education. But he will be deluded enough to believe he is of normal or even high intelligence – most stupid people are! He will therefore see the world within the limitations of the ‘bubble’ he has created for himself. Within that sort of limited perspective the ‘cherry picking’ these people indulge in probably makes sense…. This is after all what they see ‘thought leaders’ and politicos indulging in when they seek to sway the great unwashed.

      The notion that there are a huge number of people out there who are perfectly capable of assimilating the whole picture doesn’t occur to them. – Let alone the fact that there will be people out there with specialist knowledge and professional experience of these things. – Or alternatively and more cynically, the view might reasonably be taken that they don’t care about being called out on their ridiculous deceptions as people of at-least-normal intelligence and educational level just aren’t their target audience.

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      • I will try to resist developing my own conspiracy theory, but the conspiratards often seem determined to bring the causes they promote into disrepute. By attacking victims families or developing stupendously byzantine theories about events that are much more easily explained in other ways they put “normal” people off. One has to wonder if there are agent provocateurs out there cultivating such lunacy as a cover for something else. In the case of the Orlando massacre, and of the 9-11 attacks, the question is why were the perpetrators not arrested earlier when they were already known to be security risks?

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        • I completely agree with you F.S. – And I am FAR from alone, with even Police Officers, lawyers and credible Journalists considering the same question. – Many have been since Dunblane!

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          • This occurred to me as well.

            I think that police use a process of triage with security risks: they can’t arrest everyone who’s ever looked like a potential risk. The problem with this approach, of course, is that it will invariably leave truly bad people unchecked. But unless we’re willing to pay for massive increases in policing budgets, I’m not sure I see a way around that.

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      • Seeing he’s been in & out of jail so many times he’s obviously a dill. But probably thinks he’s also very smart.Cops are smarter though

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  5. Agree with all the above. And very proud of that little girl who expressed so intelligently how she was forced to tell Christie’s evil lies and the boy as well. I think they may actually be intelligent kids. Abe better watch out when these 2 become young adults. That’s unless some criminal slits his throat in Príncipe Alfonso district beforehand. He;s likely to upset some local Mafia.

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    • I’m quite sure those kids are bright, and strong-minded as well. The fact that they were able to stand up to Abe at all is remarkable. Abe seemed to have a special hatred for the girl, most likely because she was older and more stubbornly resisted his brainwashing techniques.

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  6. These conspiracy nuts are the first to say that the police have too many powers, and even try their ‘freemen’ of the land nonsense to disrupt the police going about their duties. Yet, they are also the first to complain if the police take a cautious approach building up evidence in accordance with what powers they have available. Instead, they think the police should go out and immediately arrest and body map all individuals and take all their electronic equipment, before any evidence has been found to support an allegation.

    The report details the reasoning of the police and the powers they had available. It is even honest enough to admit that there was things they could have done better. I can’t see any reason why the IPCC would disagree with the polices response.

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    • Exactly. You’d think that Abe, at least, would have had enough interactions with police to be aware of how things work.

      The fact that he thought they’d actually fall for his ridiculous charade tells all we need to know about his intellectual prowess.

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    • Indeed they do Dave, it’s part of their mythology. The Police in fact CANNOT interfere with the private lives, liberty or property of individuals without proper cause. And are obliged to make a proportionate response to any reports. – These inconvenient facts do seem to get somewhat twisted in the minds of conspiretards.

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    • The same kind of parent who would let her new boyfriend, who has a reputation for assault and has abused his own children, interrogate her kids and torture them until they repeated the stories he wanted them to tell.

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      • I think that myth ought to have died out ages ago, Joe, but apparently some still cling to it.

        In reality, claiming that all mothers have an instinct to nurture their children and protect them from harm is actually a dangerous, not to mention sexist, idea. It seems to arise from the belief that gender is destiny—clearly untrue, as anyone with an abusive, neglectful, or self-destructive mother will attest.

        Interestingly, the ‘sanctity of motherhood’ is one of the pillars of Belinda and Sabine’s ‘protect the family at all costs, even if it means children are abused’ approach to family law. It’s dangerous, it’s foolish, and ultimately it can lead to children being hurt or even dying.

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  7. Some on FB (Jake Clarke) are tweeting links to these documents with a great flourish. I’m not sure they have actually have read them. It shoots their claims down in flames. I think I’ll get some popcorn in for this one because it’s going to be fascinating when reality actually sinks in.

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      • Jesus H. Christ these people are morons :
        “been living in rural Ireland on and off for 30 years, a world-traveller who’s moved around almost 50 homes including within seven countries and three continents.”
        50 homes in 30 years?

        “one course she was in also had ex Australian Prime Minister the late Bob Hawke’s daughter in it”.
        Not only is Bob Hawke very much alive I know the family well.
        “she is on Angela’s friends list now though a silent observer mostly” : not after I inform who this vile harridan child abuser is.

        Hateful, hateful people. Liars, charlatans and cheap grifters. And child abusers.

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      • Not sure where Angie the evangeloon Christian gets off doing an interview with a witch but what do I know. They spend a bit of time defending Abe on this video and not one mention of perforated ear drums. Hmmm.

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          • So heartwarming to hear another hoaxer making a crank call and attempting to bully and harass an innocent charity worker. I believe this process is technically known as digging one’s own grave or shooting oneself in the foot.

            Remember, Deirdre luv: jelly shouldn’t run – it should wobble!

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          • “lawfully suspected”

            A lovely slice of perfectly lucid and coherent legalese from Debbie the “EU law expert” there :/

            *Rolls eyes*

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          • Deborah sounds like she’s had a drinky-poo or two. Silly bitch

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          • Today may be the last day that Mahmoudieh gets to call herself an EU law expert.

            Oh wait – she wasn’t supposed to call herself one in the first place.

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          • I think it’s unfair of her to describe the NSPCC in Hampstead as useless. They did act upon the report against Ella. How could they know that she would go on to meet a convicted child abuser fresh out of prison that would take her children to Morocco and torture them into telling tales of a cult….and stick by him at the expense of her children.

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